Curse

Xenomortis · Mar 01, 2012, 12:11 PM // 12:11

Split Mesmer builds might get away without an elite, can't see Necros fairing too well (RA doesn't matter); any eliteless hexway is going to be fairly weak.
Axe Warriors might work without an elite, since the usual elites mostly have non-elite counterparts, but I'm not sure if it'd be worth it.

Jeydra · Mar 01, 2012, 01:47 PM // 13:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xsiriss

This is just going to be terrible for eles and maybe mesmers, I mean their elites pretty much make their builds (especially eles). Physical will probably fair better overall.

One profession that's definitely not affected by the flux is Elementalist, because if they want the energy regen / extra attributes they can run Elemental Attunement and come out on top.

Boon Prot seems like the only template that benefits from the flux though: with every other template, the power lost is greater than that gained.

Xenomortis · Mar 01, 2012, 02:57 PM // 14:57

Elemental Attunement is strip bait.
Although I guess that's less true with it's lowered recharge now...

afya · Mar 01, 2012, 03:04 PM // 15:04

I'm thinking maybe rangers. Their elite isn't THAT much better than the regular skill. Maybe axe warrior too, but less likely.

----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeydra

One profession that's definitely not affected by the flux is Elementalist, because if they want the energy regen / extra attributes they can run Elemental Attunement and come out on top.

Boon Prot seems like the only template that benefits from the flux though: with every other template, the power lost is greater than that gained.

but u can bring one more skill w/o ele attune. The nowadays-common KD-spam is pretty much independent from an elite.

IamI · Mar 01, 2012, 03:23 PM // 15:23

How about an N/Rt healer. Your elite skill seems entirely optional there and you get even more overkill energy management(+1 energy) with a higher soul reaping spec.

DiogoSilva · Mar 01, 2012, 03:26 PM // 15:26

Isn't this basically a free, unstrippable semi-"Elemental Attunement" for all professions?

Xenomortis · Mar 01, 2012, 03:26 PM // 15:26

N/Rts have no Infuse, no hex removals, no strong prots other than Weapon of Warding (which Rits use better) and heal for less.
And Soul Reaping matters not in most of PvP.

MithranArkanere · Mar 01, 2012, 03:45 PM // 15:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by DiogoSilva

Isn't this basically a free, unstrippable semi-"Elemental Attunement" for all professions?

Nope. An energy pip is just 3 energy per second.

With elemental attunement, you generate way more energy than that with many builds.

Along a second attunement, you can even produce more energy than the energy you spend, keeping your energy maxed at all times.

makosi · Mar 01, 2012, 03:51 PM // 15:51

Every time there's a new flux I get the urge to do some FA or JQ but then I remember that the flux doesn't mean crap. The devs gave in to the bots and leechers and that's what actually makes the damned difference to the matches.

Perhaps they could think up new and interesting ways of banning abusers instead of spending time on these irrelevant fluxes?

Man W/ Club · Mar 01, 2012, 03:55 PM // 15:55

Some builds don't rely that much on elites but just on the power of what you do,
Some elites fall into the 'engine' catagory that they drive your build somehow or cut corners to get the same benefit, other elites are just raw power. This flux will let us not have to use the raw power elites, I am skeptical if it is enough with power creep of the metagame, maybe it is?

The point is a lot of non elites suck balls and maybe some can be good at higher attrib?

Maver1ck87 · Mar 01, 2012, 08:26 PM // 20:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeydra

One profession that's definitely not affected by the flux is Elementalist, because if they want the energy regen / extra attributes they can run Elemental Attunement and come out on top.

Boon Prot seems like the only template that benefits from the flux though: with every other template, the power lost is greater than that gained.

I have to disagree, if we use a simple example..... A standard ele bar with either...
A) elemental attunement with 7 skills
B) Fire attunemenet (or the appropriate attune for the bar) with 7 skills

A) gets +2 to Elementalist atts, 50% +1e of cast cost
B) get +2 to ALL atts, 30%+1e of cast cost, +1e regen, +2 health regen

Your analysis failed to take into account the extra skill you can bring by not taking elemental attunement !

This is very much theory craft for several reasons however allows a reasonable comparison of taking an elite vs the none elite equivalent + flux benefit.

What you would argue to this is that you would take the normal attunement with elemental attune on bar A). Therefore you need to do a more complex analysis of the benefits with the extra skill being another emanagement skill such as gole it glowing gaze etc.... I.e...
A) elemental attune + fire attune
B) fire attune + gole + flux benefits

The other factor to consider is do u have any none ele e.g. Heal breeze that will benefit more from flux than elemental attune

Of the top of my head this is one of the best comparisons between elite vs flux

Others include
Dismember vs eviscerate
Crip shot va pin down
Esurge va eburn in Dom balance gvg
Etc....

IMO each build needs to be treated on an individual basis

Our Blood · Mar 01, 2012, 08:37 PM // 20:37

Give me boon prot build, I'm lazy! and have no clue what the build is
^^ NPC mimic's are fun to do

Azazello · Mar 01, 2012, 09:28 PM // 21:28

I think you can do more with it than just swap an elite for a non elite version of the same skill on a standard bar. The boost to primary attributes is very nice, like the boon prot people are talking about here or the old scythe sins. Critical eye, way of the master, assassins remedy, wearying strike etc. Fun for RA/FA anyway, you'll get stripped like crazy elsewhere I guess, since 77% chance to crit @ 14 scythe mastery is probably even more retarded than 38% armor penetration @ 14 scythe mastery. If you did just want to swap elite for nonelite version, conjure sword @ 18 sword, 13 str, 10 air magic seems like pretty heavy pressure. For some reason I can't stop thinking of builds that depend on enchantments though >.>

If people start thinking outside the box a little there's also the potential to run 12/12/10/10 attribute splits. If you use 3 atts from your primary and run 2 majors that's 14/12/12/12. Maybe there's a Me/* or P/* build out there, or a rit running high hp (spawning power) spirits from resto/communing with a good spirit siphon to manage the energy cost. Monks with high DF/HP/PP using their secondary for energy. 12-14 spear mastery on all your casters. Seems like the ability to run a decent 4 way attribute split should be abusable in some way since it's so far outside what we're used to in guild wars, I just can't think of it :P

+2/+1 regen is also a pretty big help against all the degen spreading that is around too.

I mean most of these ideas are utter crap, I'm just pointing out that +2 to all atts is a big game changer. So are elite skills though, so obviously it's not going to be worth it in many cases.

Sharkinu · Mar 01, 2012, 11:22 PM // 23:22

Touch ranger with no elite: 2 hp regen, 1 energy regen, 4 energy touch skills, 85% change to block ranged attacks from dodge/zojun's haste, and 14(16 with Awaken the Blood) blood magic which is 71(77) hp steal. Yeah, I know I'm bored.

Kunder · Mar 01, 2012, 11:56 PM // 23:56

Touch rangers Vs prot monks with 15s SoA, muahaha its good to be evil.

If PvP actually received updates these days I would recommend leaving this flux on as a permanent feature with some minor extra skill balances.

N E D M · Mar 02, 2012, 05:25 AM // 05:25

Water ele is doable - arcane echo maelstrom lol also trappers

lacuna · Mar 03, 2012, 01:49 AM // 01:49

Replace CE with Strip Enchantment on a standard RA curse bar.

15 curse/13 sr/13 blood/3 shadow arts

Great for those pesky earth eles

Erikir · Mar 03, 2012, 11:12 PM // 23:12

Boon Prot build?

Divine Boon
RoF
condition removal skill
various other 5 energy prot skills with quick recharge
Hex removal (Deny for boon bonus)

1 - 2 skills from another class to make you more survivable vs melee (balanced/bonettis, 6(+2 flux) tactics perhaps)

Not A Standard Name · Mar 03, 2012, 11:40 PM // 23:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erikir

Boon Prot build?

Divine Boon
RoF
condition removal skill
various other 5 energy prot skills with quick recharge
Hex removal (Deny for boon bonus)

1 - 2 skills from another class to make you more survivable vs melee (balanced/bonettis, 6(+2 flux) tactics perhaps)

It works great. Today was the first time I got 25 wins as a monk.
Power Block completely owns you though.

Swingline · Mar 03, 2012, 11:52 PM // 23:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Not A Standard Name

Power Block completely owns you though.

Use only 1/4 casting time prots.